Day-4 QA - Online 10-day Retreat (Nov-17) with Delson Armstrong

Hello. Hello. All right, let's begin. Can I ask a question? Is it how different the physical pain and meditation pain? How different? Yeah. Physical pain is pain that you will still experience outside of the meditation. So it could still be an underlying pain, like in the back, in the neck, in the shoulders, and so on. Meditation pain happens essentially because of the mind becoming too focused. It becomes too one-pointed, and that translates into sometimes pain in this area, pain in the shoulder, and pain in the head. As soon as you know there's pain in the head, you know that you're trying too hard. Mind is too focused, and that will also

create a lot of thoughts in the mind, a lot of distractions. So if you recognize that there's pain here or here, especially, then you want to, first of all, relax, pull your mind back away from the meditation object, and the 6R's, and ease into the awareness of the feeling rather than focusing too hard or pushing too much. The meditation pain is a sign that the mind is pushing too much. So do I need to pay attention or let it go? Yeah. Yeah, you want to, when you recognize that the pain is there, you want to let it go and relax it. Tranquilize it. Intentionally relax it. Okay? Use the 6R's process and pull back your awareness.

on the feeling, because that's causing the meditation pain, where the awareness is too tight around the feeling. It's too constricted around the feeling. So if you start to relax and tranquilize, you're going to start to open up your awareness, and that will translate into the meditation pain dissipating. Now it might not happen all at once. You might have to do it a few times, where you have to go through a few times until you actually feel like the pain is gone. - Thank you. - Thanks. - Hey Delson. - Hello. - I wanted to know if you can talk a little bit more about the impersonal nature of things. Like if I understood correctly, reality is that it is as it is, of causes and conditions.

Does that mean that also our choices and intentions are rooted in causes and conditions eventually? And should one walk around and see other people just as processes and not just the personal nature of them? Or, I was wondering that. Every present moment is conditioned by various causes. So it's a process of dependent origination.

And the choices that we decide to make will then condition the formations in a next set of arising of dependent origination. So, insofar as our choices, they are conditioned by the links of dependent origination, up until the point of feeling and perception. And then at that point, how you react and how you respond is based on your own free choice, rather. It's more about how you decide to act, whether you want to reflect and then act, something rooted in the Dhamma, or whether you have wrong mindfulness or no mindfulness, and then create more

suffering for yourself. So depending on the choices that one makes, it will then determine the next set of formations, or the next set of sankharas, which are conditioned by those same choices, and then will either allow your choices to be more rooted in the Dhamma or not rooted in the Dhamma. So every choice you make continues to strengthen certain sankharas while weakening the fetters in the sankharas, if you're making choices that are wholesome and rooted in Dhamma.

The other thing to look at is that the choices in and of themselves are actually impersonal. If you consider the choices coming from a sense of being, that's still going to, even if they're wholesome, strengthen the fetter of conceit. It's still going to strengthen the fetter of identification. So while there may not be any craving there, which can then strengthen the fetter that then basically influences those formations, it will still strengthen the fetter of conceit, which will influence the formation in your next set of choices. An accumulation of kamma. It's nothing but an accumulation of various causes and conditions.

But there is a right way of seeing this and there's a wrong way of seeing this. If you consider it to be that everything is impersonal in the way of it being where nothing matters, then you're falling into what is nihilism or annihilationism. You're falling into the idea that, if nothing matters, then there is no kamma and there is no action and consequence.

But if you have the right view and understanding that all causes and conditions come from a previous set of causes and conditions, and these can be changed by the very nature of them being impermanent, then you are on the right track. And that helps you realize the importance of having wholesome actions, which will then produce wholesome that are rooted in Dhamma, in the sense that it is void of even the identification process. At that point, then you won't be creating any new karma for yourself.

Thank you. - Please. Well, I said of today, the thought arose with the realization that I had forgotten a responsibility. And so I was with that for a few moments deciding to let it go, but I ended up deciding I'll make that phone call and complete that responsibility and return to meditation. So please comment on that.

If there are certain things that drive you forward that you know need to be done in the way of responsibility, those should be done first, because that, first of all, is a sense of karma that feels unfulfilled, or a sense of action that needs to be done. Taken as long as it's something that helps you to continue on with your meditation practice. In other words, if it's something that you need to do that might be difficult to do but needs to be done, it should be done from a wholesome perspective and a wholesome state of mind. If it's something that will help you still develop a wholesome state of mind, then you should do it, because in trying to just let it go, it could get in the way of your meditation practice. It's better to let that thing occur, or let the action be taken, so that the mind doesn't become distracted by it. Yes. Thank you. I have two questions about the sutta from day four.

One is in the Sutta, Sariputta, I think, goes about the links of dependent origination one by one, but only if he is asked by the attending monks. So my first question would be, if those monks were just satisfied or didn't think to ask any further, would he just have the first set? So would that sutta only be 20 lines in length in total?

And the second question would be, he was about these links one by one as the monks asked him if someone were to not this question might be a bit out there I'm sorry but if the if someone were to not know about these links and perhaps later come to realize it being is a certain way or coming to realize about the nature of reality in a certain way, would they still point to these 12 links or would they perhaps conceptualize it in a different way? - Yeah, okay.

So for your first question in regards to the monks asking Sariputta about the various links, stopping at a certain point, there's a parallel to this story where it's just one monk asking Sariputta the same set of questions. And this comes from the Chinese Agamas. And I believe the monk who is asking Sariputta is an arahant. So a lot of times when these monks ask another monk a question, it's really for the purpose of understanding from outside of that conversation. In other words, those monks who would be asking, taking into consideration the Chinese Agama, may already be arahants or may already have the awareness and understanding to some extent of the links of dependent origination.

But out of compassion, they ask it for the other monks who might not be aware of the links of dependent origination, or who might not be aware of this kind of wisdom. But having said that, it could happen that they might stop asking, and the sutta might be just that short. Regardless, the perspective should be that this is being done for the sake of future generations as well, so that eventually, when it was passed down orally, the monks who were listening to it had a better understanding of the links of dependent origination, and then of course when it started getting written down, whether in the suttas or the Agamas, and so on.

The second question you had was about the insight into the links of dependent origination itself. What happens, in the understanding and context of the Dhamma, is that at a certain point the Dhamma declines, and less and less people have wisdom, and less and less beings have the understanding of dependent origination. And then the whole cycle continues again when there is a self-enlightened Buddha, meaning that Buddha who realizes for himself the understanding of the links of dependent origination.

And then he is really the pathfinder. He's the one who rediscovers this understanding. He puts it forth to other people, and then invariably they will have the understanding and then become arahants. And then there are also solitary Buddhas who do have this understanding but they don't go out and teach. But they have the insight that arises for themselves.

So it could be that there is an understanding that comes through the perspective of the insight of dependent origination without even being introduced to the Dhamma, let's say. But it can only stretch so far, because the complete understanding according to the context of Dhamma is coming from a self-enlightened Buddha who discovers the path, who cultivates the path, who develops the path to such an extent that he can tell you the ins and outs in every direction, going back and forth and three-dimensional, and so on and so forth. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Okay. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Yeah, I wonder how joy comes up. A better way to increase the joy.

So joy comes from release, from letting go. In the case of the first jhana, the joy that arises is the pleasure that comes from the mind secluded and withdrawn from the five physical sensory experiences, letting go of your attention towards the five physical sensory experiences and collecting mind upon mind. Joy will naturally arise because you're releasing your attention away from that. So joy is a natural reaction, or a natural process, that arises from release. And as you get deeper and you start to cultivate empathetic joy, that arises as a natural progression when you get into loving kindness and then into compassion, where you are celebrating in the happiness of other people, and that naturally arises passion to such an extent that when the mind sees joy, wholesome joy in other beings and sees the cessation of suffering in other beings, that empathetic joy arises.

So it is the inclining away from suffering, inclining away from the five physical sense spaces coming into the mind and collecting it, that joy will naturally arise. So the more the mind inclines away from suffering and goes towards letting go and inclines more towards nibbana, joy will naturally arise. I have a sort of follow up question to that. So there's the radiation of the feeling to a spiritual friend.

And the joy and certain feelings come up best when relaxed. Does that mean that the joy naturally follows and all one has to do is really just direct it to the spiritual friend and just stop there? So what you're sending to the spiritual friend is the loving kindness. The experience that you have for yourself when you come up with a happy memory or a happy image or gratitude or verbalizing it, that then creates or generates the loving kindness that arises. higher of loving-kindness.

And then when the mind and the body is suffused with that, it naturally wants and inclines towards sharing it with a spiritual friend. And so the joy that arises is a natural progression towards the first and second jhana because your mind becomes so inclined towards loving-kindness that it lets go of the other thoughts and hindrances and remains collected around the loving kindness, so the joy arises because of the abandoning of the craving, abandoning of the hindrances, and then that naturally progresses into ease of body which is sukha. It's the happiness of the body and the mind, and that's a calmer form of joy. These two, joy and happiness, come together in the first and second jhana, and then eventually it starts to just calm down and there is this clarity of mind, which then further deepens with very strong mindfulness in the fourth jhana and a very steady presence of mind.

I see. Thank you. So adding to that, I will say then that what's important to see is when you do the four right efforts, especially in, let's say, the context of the 6R's, when you release your attention away from it and you relax, which means when you prevent any unwholesome states from further arising by recognizing first and then the abandoning of the unwholesome states, natural relief that is found in that. In that natural relief that's found there is a spring of joy. So if you try to see this you will notice that in letting go of hindrances, in letting go of distractions, there is a natural happiness and clarity that emerges from that, and that in itself brings up that wholesome state or the beginning of the wholesome state, which is further strengthened through the smile and then further strengthened by putting your attention back on loving kindness.

Thank you. I have a question here. So I was reading the Visuddhimagga the other day. And the section on loving kindness, in fact. I know that's a strange thing for me to do, right? But I can help notice that this is where the spiritual friend is described step by step up until breaking down the barriers.

And I also noticed that this context is, of course, in a one-pointed absorption concentration kind of context, right? Explain exactly who you can choose, who you cannot choose, who is better to start with and who's not. Of course, it's one focus, right? And they describe how to enter appana, which is for upachara samadhi, which is, of course, commentarial.

Literature, cannot be found in the suttas, these pre-absorption samadhis. Sorry, my question is a little technical. And of course, one person to enter one-pointed states. And so we noticed that here the Buddhist teaching left this completely open, broad awareness, which is found in the suttas, which is found in the way the Buddha taught metta, completely open to all living beings.

And now it has changed to a single person that is going towards one point in this. So I was wondering, what do you think about practicing a completely open, loving kindness, bringing up a spiritual friend when it is needed to uplift the mind, like in the nun's residence sutta, and then staying with broad open? Would that work? Yeah. One of the things that I have talked about with people individually is you can bring up the feeling, and then you refer to the nun's residence sutta, where it says that he gladdens the mind with a wholesome object, I believe. That's something like that. Am I correct?

Yes. Uplifting mind. Uplifting, yes. Uplifting object. Uplifts the mind, yes. One of the things that I tell people is that you can start to bring up a wholesome image. It could be any image that naturally gladdens the heart. It could be the image of a puppy holding a baby. It could be gratitude, things you're grateful for. It could be a happy memory, so long as you let go of the memory and stay with the feeling, because people have a tendency to then explore that memory, and then that can create nostalgia, which then does not state so. These are all good starting points to bring up the loving-kindness, and then once the mind and body are suffused with this loving-kindness, it has a natural inclination to want to share it, and that's when you would bring up the spiritual friend and so on. There are difficulties met by some people in doing that, actually, where they start to visualize the spiritual friend or they start to visualize the sense of flowing to the spiritual friend, and if it helps them because they're visually oriented, that's all the better.

Do that all the better as long as their awareness is still open, but some people have difficulty with that because it feels like the mind is then too focused on staying with the image of the spiritual friend or focused on the feeling of flowing it out and sending it to the spiritual friend and so on. So what I encourage them to do then is, rather than trying to focus on all of these things, so long as there's the awareness of the metta, so long as there's the awareness of the feeling with the intention that it's going to the spiritual friend, that's fine too to that extent. And then that will naturally progress on to the other aspects of the jhanas and so on and so forth.

So even if you were to use, let's say, meditation objects from the Visuddhimagga or commentarial literature, you could still use the process of right effort and stay with the open awareness, and it would be just as effective. No matter what the object is, so long as there is an open awareness that is clear enough and open enough to see when hindrances arise while using whatever it might be, whether it's the metta, whether it's any of the brahmaviharas, whether it's the breath as a reminder, whether it's anything at all really, as long as it's wholesome and allows the mind to be present and creates an anchor for the mind to remain wholly present and fully aware, so long as it's there, and you are seeing how the hindrances are arising and how mind works in that process, and able to use the right effort to be able to let go of the hindrances that arise and then come back to the wholesome object. I believe that's fine. So one can still use some of the elements, let's say as you were mentioning, where you do breaking down the barriers and so on and so forth.

As long as you keep maintaining what is spoken of in the suttas, which is that broad awareness of the present reality and the present moment and seeing how mind's attention moves from one thing to another and then bringing it back to that object of meditation. Thank you. And that brings me to perhaps this second fold of the same question. I totally agree with you when you say that whatever wholesome object is a wholesome, uplifting object. That doesn't matter if it comes from a commentary. I do completely agree with that. And I do believe that this was a bit of a trick question, but I do believe that the breaking down the barriers is a wonderful exercise.

Yeah. For as far as the exercises go. Yeah. But as far as the Buddha's meditation as taught in the suttas, there is also another point which comes up. That is the first level of meditation, for example, which the Buddha says, go or detaching of the senses and then letting go of the unwholesome states. And then this is accompanied by thinking and projecting, imagining with something.

And the second jhana, thinking, reflecting, fades away. And would you think that this, if there is still a holding on to a certain, because that's the nun's residence, is in fact talking, he's mentioning vitakka vicara. When this has been used to uplift the mind, one lets that go and stays with this broad open awareness. So I was wondering. Go ahead, please.

What your thoughts are on this? If instructions are to stick with this one thing of the spiritual friend, when it has uplifted the mind and the feeling can be fully open, wouldn't that create tension just by itself? Because we're trying to push the we talk of each other. further into jhana, which is in fact supposed to follow it. Yeah, it's interesting. Vitakka and vicara I see as when you have the intention of the loving kindness, so the vitakka and vicara that arises, the thinking and examining thought, the thinking and imagining that arises when you think about things, for example, that you might be grateful for, or imagine, as I said, the image of a puppy, or imagine something that is wholesome, that gladdens the mind.

To that extent, when that happens, you have the joy and the sukha, the calm happiness, arise quite naturally because of that. But the intention here is not to hold on to the image or not to hold on to the spiritual friend either. It is to allow that wholesome quality of mind to sustain itself through the awareness of it, through the attention on it. So I see that the generating of the loving kindness as being the vitakka and the vicara, being the intention of generating, being the vitakka and vicara. And the way I see it is when you let go of the intention and rest your awareness on it.

What you're actually doing is your attention is continuing to feed the loving-kindness, so to speak, but it's not generating it anymore, meaning it's not pushing, it's not having an effort to continue to have that loving-kindness. This is why a lot of people in the beginning have quite a lot of problems where they say, well, I have the loving-kindness, because I'm pushing.

So in that pushing, you are still using intention to continue to generate loving kindness. But once it is generated, you let go of the intention to generate and rest the awareness on it. And the attention itself on it, the awareness itself, will continue to sustain it and will naturally progress into the rest of the factors of the subsequent jhanas. Wonderful exposition of the end of the path today. Thank you. I like to be abandoning even the concept of Nibbana, which is before entering Nibbana. switch.

So I would like to request Bhante Ananda to share merit, please. May suffering ones be suffering free and the fear struck fearless be. May the grieving shift of grief and may all beings find relief. May all beings share this merit that we have thus acquired for the acquisition of all kinds of happiness. May beings in navigating space and earth, devas and nagas of mighty power. Have a good day and evening. Thank you. You too, Bhante. Thank you.