Day-2 QA - Online 10-day Retreat (Nov-3) with Delson Armstrong

I do have a question about the Satipatthana Sutta. I know it's being discussed a lot. Again, the difference between internal and external. Because as I see it, you can view external as being the body. But you can also view it as the outside world, including other people. People, yes. Just to make sure I understood the question correctly, you're saying that in the case of the Satipatthana, when it's talking about internal, external, body, you're talking about in relation to contact with the body? Yes. The inside piece says in relation to external things, phenomena, whatever, or internally, or both externally and internally? Yeah. I see that. In one way, it can be related to external phenomenon outside of the body. It can also be related to the input of the five physical senses, the sensory experiences that arise from it. So that can be the external aspect of it. The internal is really more related to the mind and the mental contents of the mind, but also there is the

physical sensations that happen within the body itself as well, which is in relation to feeling, for example the heartbeat. You're feeling the blood rushing through the veins, the digestive processes, different parts of the functions that happen within the body. That's another internal aspect of it. Thank you. Hello? Listen, hello. Just now, when I was listening to your Satipatthana Sutta, I suddenly came to this understanding that it's saying what it says. Wait a minute, I'm looking over that.

So, it says that he observes mind objects as mind objects to the extent that there is only this mindfulness. Does it mean that we don't have to focus tightly on that particular phenomenon? Yeah... How could it be understood? Can you say that again, what you read? Let me look into that. "...both arising and vanishing, or else mindfulness that there is mind objects is simply established in him to the extent necessary for bare knowledge and mindfulness." Yeah, okay. The interesting thing about the Satipatthana Sutta, the four foundations of mindfulness, is that within each foundation, there are different ways to develop mindfulness.

And in all four categories, in all four foundations, you will notice, or as the mindfulness is there, there is the mindfulness of the arising and passing away of the feeling within the body, of the sensory experiences. There is the arising and passing away of the processes of the phenomena that are happening within and outside of the body. There's the arising and passing away of the thoughts. Within the context of the meditation, for example, when you are meditating, you are applying mindfulness to the extent that your awareness, or you are observing the object. You are just staying present with the feeling, whatever the brahmavihara might be.

And as you're staying with it, you might see thoughts arise and pass away in the background. Your awareness is so open. Your mindfulness is there to the extent that you can see these things. But because you're not so fully focused, you're not suppressing the ability of the mind to apply this observational power. That's one reason why I translate, for example, mindfulness as observation, because observation is all about being aware and observing all of the phenomena that's happening with this unification of mind around the object.

While the mind is unified around the object, while it's aware with its attention around the object, it's still mindful of things that might arise in the way of hindrances or insights that might arise, or what kind of factors that might be present. It's not to say that you're looking for it. That's the bare knowledge. That's the bare awareness, which is: it arises when it arises and it comes into your field of knowledge. When you notice it, when you see it, but only to the extent of you seeing it, not looking for it, not trying to find it. It will come to you, as long as you keep your awareness open.

Thanks. Thanks for the explanation. I have another question. Yeah, yeah. This is related to the seven factors of enlightenment. For example, what I notice in my practice is that many times I bring up the factor more than required. How effectively, can you give any suggestions to... Yeah. Yeah. Anytime... Yeah, go ahead. Go ahead. Did you finish? Yeah. Any suggestions so that we can just bring up the factor enough? Yeah. Not... Yeah. Especially when you're in the eighth level, when you're in neither perception or non-perception. You're really playing with the factors at that point in time, trying to balance them. What happens is, if you notice that there's a factor missing, like you need more tranquility, and you just immediately create the intention for tranquility to the point that it creates too much tranquility, what you'll also notice is you're putting in too much effort, which means not only are you bringing tranquility, but you're bringing in too much energy.

So, energy is when you put in too much effort. But the way to look at it is like a medicine dropper. You know, have you seen those medicine droppers where you drop one bit by bit? When you notice that the mind is restless, for example, and you need tranquility, you have a drop of intention that, okay, now a little bit of tranquility is required. That's the way you do it. Very small doses, very small drops. Or if you're coming into sloth and torpor, where the mind is becoming sluggish, you bring in a little bit of joy, just a drop of joy, and then see what happens. Drop by drop, bit by bit. It's better to be more cautious in sending this out rather than starting it, you know, where, okay, I'm going to push it and I'm going to put in the tranquility. You just pull back, little by little, and if you see, okay, I need a little bit more, another drop or another drop. So do it from that kind of a perspective.

Yeah, that was a great explanation. I will try that. That intercepts, right? I mean, are coming to perfectly interrelated... Sorry, you dropped off for about 15 seconds. My connectivity is not that great here, so if you can repeat the question, repeat the statement. Okay, yeah. It was not a question, but what I was saying is that in the discourse you mentioned how these precepts are connected to... Yeah, yeah. So the explanation was pretty nice. It was like both things are perfectly

Connected. Yeah, yeah. So that helps you. That helps you be more mindful of seeing if, okay, I am following this precept or not. And then likewise, when you go into the meditation and you see that there's this particular hindrance arising, you can go back into your mind and say, okay, did I have this precept being followed, or did I break it, or what happened? And then it really provides a little bit of a mindfulness of that. Yeah, and one more.

The fourth precept, which you explained, you extended that to sense, all sense craving, right? Can you just... Yeah, so the thing about, the thing about you're talking about sensual craving, which is the hindrance related to sexual misconduct, right? Yeah, yeah. So the thing about that is, when you have sexual misconduct, that means you are committing a sexual act in a way that is harmful to yourself and harmful to the other individual. And that really means, in a way that makes you your senses, or the pleasure that is derived from the sexual act, you identify it to such a level that your mind identifies with that sensory experience of the sexual nature. So by doing that, your mind also starts to cling and attach to other sensory experiences in the same way. So for example, if you start to find craving in your visual forms and in the other five senses as well, the mind will attach to those senses, will attach to the sensory experiences, and because it attaches to it and craves it, it causes heedlessness in the mind. And heedlessness means carelessness.

And because of that, there is lack of judgment, lack of understanding, and then a person acts in a way that creates misconduct, not only sexual misconduct in which you harm yourself and the other, but even in sensory craving and sensual craving, where you become careless to the point that you just crave for those sensual experiences, you crave for the sensory experiences. And in doing so you commit other acts that are not in alignment with the Noble Eightfold Path, and you break further precepts because of it. Thanks. Thank you. All right. It does. So I wonder if you could explain: does the smile become less necessary when you're in neither perception or non-perception? It seems like, I think, certainly the physical smile, maybe, but is there still a need for a smile in the mind, to the extent that when you're balancing the factors, right, so when you require a little bit of joy, so you can bring in the internal smile to bring up the joy, but

In terms of a physical smile, at that point I would say when you're in nothingness and neither perception or non-perception, especially, you're not so much in contact with the physical, and actually pretty much not. It's all mental. It's mostly mental, like 95% mental. So in that process, when you are dealing with the factors of awakening and when you require any kind of joy to be put in there, it can help to maybe use the smile as, it can help to use a smile as an anchor, as a carrier for that joy. So it will help to that extent, yes.

Thank you. Hi. I wanted to ask, actually, a very practical question. In a sense, how do you see the balancing factors in a situation, for example, if you have a situation with children or maybe animals, when you have to set a clear boundary, maybe even use a lot of energy in a quick moment where there's a lot of instinct, and to, you know, use loving kindness, but still, you know, with this energy sometimes it's hard to keep it. And I wonder if the higher you get in connection to meditation... Yeah. Can you say the last part, where you said the higher something? It froze for me. Maybe when you come to the higher point of meditation, to higher genres, when you get more skilled in balancing and also more quiet, and you think it's like a process that comes by itself, that's also when you have to use a lot of energy and set boundaries within this situation, that it's, it comes by itself, the calmness and the way you put the relationship more properly, not

using so much force or maybe even going in. Sometimes you get angry in these situations. There, yeah, not that you want to, but you know, it's like the energy that you... it brings, yeah. Yes, sometimes the energy will bring restlessness, for beings, right, and then that restlessness can result in acting in ways that can cause harm emotionally, or it can create energy that creates anger, or whatever it might be. But the way to do it, and first and foremost, what you have to see in relation to the seven factors,

whether you are balancing sloth and torpor or you're balancing restlessness, there is always mindfulness used. There's always observation used. So even in practical and daily life, first and foremost, mindfulness must be there. When there is mindfulness, there is awareness of what the situation requires. And more importantly, when you're dealing in situations where you need to be a little more energetic and you need to be a little bit more active in whatever it is that you're doing, it's important to turn that mindfulness internally and to see, okay, if I am acting in this way, is it causing restlessness in me? So by using the mindfulness, you can see whether it's creating a restless nature in the mind.

And with that mindfulness, if you see that it's creating a restless nature in the mind, then you know, okay, well, now I need to bring in some tranquility. So there, again, you use the pause to take a few seconds to bring in the tranquility, to bring in the equanimity, and then wait, and then act from that. So that while you need to be energized, while you need to be active in whatever it is you're doing or implementing for the situation, that energy is infused with tranquility, that energy is calmer. And so it's more stable and not as erratic.

Yes, it makes sense. Thank you. So you are saying you can use the awakening factors in daily life too? Yes, that's right. Nelson? Yeah. Hello, Nelson. I have a question. Yesterday's Q&A, we talked about the importance of not moving the body while meditating. Uh, what about when you open your eyes and you look at the clock and see how long you've been meditating, or when we're just talking about the smiling and you move your face to smile, would that be considered movement of the body as well? That would be considered movement of the body. So I'll break it up into a couple of things. When I was mentioning yesterday about moving, I was talking about number one, intentionally moving out of restlessness, or intentionally moving because the body feels like it needs to move when it's not necessary to move. But secondly, when it comes to things like where you open up your eyes, if you're doing it because

it's just a process. In some cases, when somebody is in infinite consciousness, the eyes might just open up, you know, or if they're experiencing lots of joy in the sixth jhana, the eyes might just open up, and that just happens as an automatic reflexive process. And so it's not necessarily coming from your intention to open the eyes. But in relation to what I was telling Anthony earlier about the smile, I'm referring more to seeing and using the smile to the extent that you need the joy there, so it can be the internal smile, or to see if you need the smile on the physical level to bring up that joy. But that I would not consider to be physical movement, as compared to something like moving your limbs or moving a posture or something like that, because remember when you're doing the sixth jhana process there is still the movement of the mouth, there is still the movement of the lips in order to come to the smile. So to that extent you can move if you need to smile, but beyond that you don't want to move intentionally.

Hi Delson, I have one question. Is it possible that in infinite consciousness, infinite consciousness is happening, but I could not feel the joy? It's for the brief moment, you know, like it's a lot of things happening, but I don't notice joy. I feel like I'm in equanimity, however... yeah, flickering is happening, yeah. It can still happen that for some beings, when they get into infinite space and they're sending out the metta and then sending out the compassion, they completely, sometimes, bypass even compassion and bypass joy. So if it is there for a few moments, that's fine. If it's not present, that's fine. But so long as you are sending out something, whether it is compassion or metta or whatever it is in that moment while you're experiencing infinite consciousness, that's okay.

That's all right. The thing is, traditionally speaking, the empathetic joy that arises, that's just this pure joy that arises at the ability to celebrate people's successes and the ability to celebrate their joys, is something that can be cultivated just as an exercise in your daily life. So when you see somebody happy, when you see somebody smiling, you return that generosity with the smile, you empathize with their ability to be happy, you empathize with their successes, and so on and so forth. So that's one way of cultivating in practical life. But it doesn't always need to translate into or be connected with the sixth jhana of infinite consciousness. So if that's not arising, I would not consider that to be an issue.

It's just, as long as you're radiating something, whether it's metta or compassion or equanimity, that's all that really matters. Thank you. Delson, during one of my recent meditations in neither perception or non-perception, I got to a point where I felt like I'd bypassed the movies that I usually get. That's usually as far as I've ever been with it. And it was just like little kids a little bit.

And I feel like that was almost done on a conscious level, to move beyond the video film style things that I usually get, because I wasn't needing them anymore or not interested in them. Like, is that... am I on the right track with that? You are on the right track. You see, in the beginning what will happen is these movies, these little disconnected thoughts that arise, they are part of the entry point into neither perception or non-perception, and slowly, little by little, they start to gradually go away as the mind continues to let go of these formations, let go of these perceptions, on an automatic level. And there can be a point where, and you mentioned you consciously bypassed it, meaning you just basically what did you do? You ignored it, or you just let it go? What did you do? Yeah, I think that ignored it was almost like lost interest, and it was lost interest in it. Yeah. Yeah, yeah. Say what she said just five minutes, five seconds ago, because it got hazy.

I think it was a combination of them both, of being ignored and losing interest in it. Yeah, I think that's what it was. So okay, so we have to make sure. It's getting into semantics, but one thing I want to make sure is, if you are ignoring it, is it ignoring in the way of suppressing it, or allowing it to be there, just not having your attention there? If your attention is not on it, then that's what you would consider ignoring, and becoming disinterested in it. I see no problem with that. But if you're intentionally forcing it down or intentionally suppressing it, then two things: one, that would be the wrong way of doing it, and secondly, you're no longer in the jhana when you do that, because now you're using much coarser aspects of the mind to do that. But if you're allowing your attention to just be on quiet mind and just not paying attention to those subtle formations, allowing it to be let go of and losing interest in it, that's a step in the right direction, because that's getting into dispassion, that's getting into disenchantment. Okay, thank you.

into dispassion that's getting into disenchantment okay thank you Now, we have time for one or two more questions, so if anybody else... Thank you. i'll say something if i can yeah um i don't know if it's a question the material that we have for this retreat is so good and i i love the documents that we're reading the documents i guess that you've written and then they then the suit this and then listening and i'm feeling like it would really like i need a week for each one yeah so i'm wondering um i kind of feel like i should i just pick what resonates and go with that or do you have any suggestions for that yeah i would say that if you want to just choose one and stay with that and you know if there's some piece of information that really resonates

and pick up on that that's fine i do understand because we were doing you could say like a focus group for the text before the retreat it was not intended for this retreat primarily it was going to be for the retreat that i was going to do in europe and so on but since we had the opportunity to do an online retreat i then kind of divided it up for for that But basically, the focus group kind of said the same thing, which is that there's quite a lot of stuff in there and it would take some time to really decompress it for people's minds and things like that. but if there's certain things in there that you pick up on that you really want to just explore on your own you're welcome to you know it's not like you need to necessarily follow along if you need more time to develop your practice around certain elements of the text or it feels like you need to slow down your pace that's fine too so you should do this at your own pace okay all right thank you

Okay, so I think we can then share merit, unless anyone else might have a question. Give it like 20 more seconds. Okay, can you please bring up the slide? I'll share. Yeah, thank you. I'll make sure everybody can see it today. Okay, can you please... me? Yeah. One moment. Let's see here. Can you, can you Delson, can you please make... yeah. Okay, here we go. Everyone can see it. Yes, yes. All right, all right. Yes, thank you, thank you. Sorry about that. Let's

Go for it. May suffering ones be suffering free, and the fear-struck fearless. May the grieving shadow grief. May all beings find relief. May all beings share this merit that we have thus acquired for the acquisitions of all kinds of happiness. May beings in the happening space and earth, neighbours and nagas, some power she is married always, may they long protect the Buddha's dispensation. Thank you, thank you everyone. Thank you, thank you, thank you everyone. Thank you, thank you.